Super League Debut to Heart Surgery — Kiel's Story

Hello everybody. This is episode 19. Today we're joined by Kale. We've got a bit of a mad story today. So we'll uh we'll kick straight off and we'll start right from uh your sporting background if you want.

Okay. Where where it started? Whether it's where it from school, where it from before school. Is it always been a hobby? You tell me. >> Yeah.

So, sort of obviously ruby league and >> Yeah. >> been from Been from Czechfield, Ponty. Um, >> h the checks. >> We're all from the same place. >> Checkers are back. >> Local club off Lions and sort of rubber league. So, yeah. So, it started when I was five years old. My granddad was sort of my father figure. um took me down there at 5 and yeah was found a love for playing rugby really.

So um played there all throughout my childhood. And >> do you have to get do you have to get not say scouted then you don't have to get the scouted for lions or do you join them as as you know like I used to play said Joy's football and you could just go down to training but it's same thing we have lions I sort of sort of did that until sort of 13 14 and all scouts start coming to watching stuff and um obviously like districts and all that yeah and stuff started at like 13 so got picked for like Wakefield service area which were like local districts from that they pick like Yorkshire and they pick like the England and sort of camp and then they pick a squad out of that. So luckily I yeah so I started at five up to sort of 13 still played at Feb Lions until I was 16 but from sort of 13 I played like rep rugby. Um that's when I thought you know I'm going to try and make this crap for a for a career. Um well for for anybody who doesn't know so we're all from the same area.

Um and I when I was in year seven when you were year 11 were you or were you >> I'm still below your so think. Yeah, I think so. Were you in line L pack? >> Year below. Sorry. >> A year below. Yeah.

So, L would Yeah. So, you would have been >> st as well. >> Yeah. Year 10, 11. You were like, you obviously seem massive compared to us. They still do like >> uh Yeah, they were always like, you know, American style.

We're all all football players and it were like that's what all you were like to us. So, uh yeah, it's a bit mad even just doing this now, but so yeah, car carry on, mate. So, from the um from being scouted, what the first team that you got scoured for? Oh, Bradford and that when Bradford Bulls when that were their like era where they were winning everything is that Danny Danny was Yeah. So >> Fergie Fergie there too was Fergie >> when did he come Bradford at some point?

No >> he did. Yeah he had that later on. Yeah but when I sort of started at Bradford it were like Bay Colo and Shante and like they were they were they were class and then I signed him. No >> no correlation. So, so I went on scholarship they had a 14 actually at 14 and 15 not many people know but from two year on shot I got voted best playing in country like we're called top gun so you go to these Yorkshire and England camps and they pick like a top gun out of like full country basically >> and for two year on dance I got like top the top gun award um which >> class you know >> people need to know that mate I'm glad you've done this >> as a young um as a young kid like I thought >> yeah you were pretty cool to be fair >> sick Alex Now I'm better than you cuz you don't know I didn't lion but um yeah so obviously that went on and then end up signing pro at Bradford for Bradford then following that two year on scholarship at 16 and then um then my super league debut at 17 sort of a barby really but >> yeah and so and how many how many years for it because obviously like I said right at the beginning it's all been a bit of a mad story that's led us to where you are today and and we've got you in because you've got everything from the sporting background through professional athlete to a business owner to even more problems later now which you're also having to overcome again.

So um >> how long would it until >> the first obstacle? >> The first obstacle. Yeah. >> Well, it's probably another one before that to be fair. Sort of. So I might have spoke about another podcast. So basically at 16, my granddad who I referred to before who took my training all the way through from being 5 years old were traveling to train at Bradford and we had been a car crash and they passed away in that car crash. >> No second me training. >> It was [\h__\h] So I was 16 and I just signed sort of in the academy at Bradford. >> So 16 years old. >> 16 m.

Yeah. So that was sort of I've always used it as a motive. You know what I mean? Like just uh I think I've got stuff going on. I sort of he was taking me there.

I just retired and he passed away doing doing what he loved taking me you know to rugby. >> Yeah. So if you don't mind me asking what what happened in the car crash with an oncoming driver just >> so we just do you know um we were sort of pulling off towards leads M6 um towards M621 off M62 on slip road there and M1 and there was some traffic on like um where you pull off on you know work traffic like I said. >> Yeah. And it were like it were backed up a bit to on sort of motorway and we'd stopped like in traffic and then transit man just hit us up back like they were me and Danny had worried car and lions were taking off he was training obviously grandad been older and more fragile he passed away and we probably only got through it because of young fate lads and you know what I so yeah they were a bit of so that one probably >> that's definitely the best obstacle the first obstacle I'd say um yeah I've had to overcome you know what I mean such an awful thing like when you hear about those kind cuz it's out of your control completely and one person's mistake can cost their life that's just >> it's crazy just like all the traffic accidents that you hear happen. >> Yeah. >> And he puts it into perspective like it's only couple of seconds and it's over. >> Oh it's I don't know. Yeah. So obviously we let that sort of >> I young at times so it were all sort of uh >> I don't know seems a bit hard to comprehend it all like looking back now it's all like muddled up in my head you know what I mean if I can't really I do recall it but it seems that long ago but yeah still there do you know what I mean and I I sort of I know there were a process after that where I probably went off rails a little bit as a 16-year-old.

Yeah. started going on piss too much and like I remember Steve McNamaru what coach at time he actually come to come to me nana's house in checkers and were like so I went I think I went back in in after offseason I were in [\h__\h] shape and they were like you're 16 I know what you've gone through with your granddad and so I had a pet talk to me and said if you want to make it or you want this to be a career you're going to have to try and overcome it and use it to your advantage which >> if you weren't for that talk you know it could have been a completely different story my life could have gone Yeah, >> that way rather than where luckily where I've sort of what I've achieved so far. >> It's one of those things though like you can't you can't really blame me for going off the rails cuz that must have been traumatizing like you didn't know how to deal with it. >> Well, yeah. like round obviously I just met my misses who I'm still with now and like obviously I met her I met her young Jack and if it weren't for little things like that and her put me back into sort of keeping me on track >> yeah it's it's one of them and you know there's there's obviously several other things and there's a lot of people that probably that I probably at the time didn't realize but were there for the shoulder that >> I appreciate to this day but you know and everybody offered this a far but >> you're like to think that if it were one of my lads at that age now, I'd be like, "Yeah, how would they take it?" I don't really >> think everyone everyone you wouldn't know until you're in that position, would you? So, like you said, you obviously went off rails, but I'm guessing when you come back then, you are highly driven and probably stronger mind like everything we go through is extreme as it is. It forges who we are, doesn't it, in the personality, how we play, how we how you put that into what you're doing. So, uh, obviously you put it into the right >> way once you got once you got back on that path, but >> yeah. And that's I just sort of, yeah, I had to have a sort of >> again, I was young and probably naive and sort of just had to think, you know, where do I want to go?

Like, do you know what I mean? And what would my granddad want? He actually >> he died taking me training. I don't want to [\h__\h] it all up now. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Do you know do you know what I mean?

So, that's what >> It's like he has an obligation to keep cracking on. >> Yeah. I got me contract. Do I do I leave do I leave it and just be a normal lad who's going out on Po weekend? How do I actually try and make some crack of it and and I could start making sacrifices? Yeah. >> And luckily that's what I sort of started doing.

And >> did you have a couple of years at Bradford then or were you? >> Yeah. Yeah. So I decided there obviously leaving school um I had two years. I had two years I made my Super League debut there like I said at 17. um only played one game um and then I just feel coming for me after that like so that's when end up leaving um then obviously Bradford was sort of going on the downward spiral slightly and yeah we're getting a new coach and and all this kind of stuff but um yeah so not well but not the first sort of obstacle really. Yeah. >> Yeah.

Not just a bit. Yeah. Jesus I never knew that like I've known you for years and I never I never knew that. So >> yeah, but well done though. >> What what happened after that then? You said what happened with the rugby then?

What what got you through that? I'm guessing it's the second obstacle. What happened with the rugby? >> Yeah. So obviously got back on track, started eating right, limiting when I went out, sort of doing it at right times. Still young, so you're going to go out after a game and stuff. >> How old were you when you had Joe Jack? >> 16.

Oh yeah. >> Wow. Yeah. Had >> that. If I had had a kid at 16, like I had I had my little girl last year when I was 16. [\h__\h] Jesus. >> You're still under. No.

I like >> Yeah. No fat guy. >> I still haven't got a [\h__\h] clue now. >> Going back to that though, like I luckily I had I had other things. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> And not the normal 16y old lad. I I had something else to keep, you know, to keep me occupied and give me that different sort of >> I guess I bet that was sort of out your personality going out though at that point was it? I bet you were obviously super motivated to be a professional athlete.

So >> 100%. Yeah. So I went from being really strict with everything coming out of school to having that adversity sort of going off going completely off. >> Yeah. Looking back now, I did like literally I going out like so much and eating [\h__\h] eating [\h__\h] and just doing wrong things. >> That's what you find happens with a lot of rugby lads though. Like they get derailed when they get access to going out and stuff like that.

I mean, I remember going around Ponty for years. I won't name names some very high ranking rugby players and usually see him getting [\h__\h] sloshed like three days a week. It was just like then next day you'll see him on a game just playing completely. I'm like how's he doing that? How are you keeping up? >> Yeah, you should go now.

But yeah. Um but yeah, so sort of got back on track after after that adversity, started doing right things again and um signed for Ruddersfield. Um only played one Super League game at Bradford. So I was still in sort of a good caliber because at 17 18 to actually play to play a professional super league on Sky were pretty good and big, you know. So signed for Ruddersfield in quite high regard.

Um but I had a shoulder operation my first off season. So I left Bradford and I had to have my shoulder operated on. I had to have a reconstruction on my shoulder. Um so that first year atfield really well I sort of I was still young anyway but they had some they had some sort of players who were more experienced in my position and that first year was sort of finding me at a new club. >> Yeah. Um but the second preseason I went into that thinking I'm having a go here like and I literally didn't I just didn't have a breath.

I just trained all the way through offseason. >> Like I I went back I went back in proper good shape like I was smashing fitness drills. I shook one of strongest sneak gym and I thought this is me. I'm going to try and I'm going to try and you know crack it like and >> and I actually so first round that season I got I started I started like I started I went on bench started game. >> What was your position? >> Uh yeah. Yeah. It won Skywalk it Cardiff at Millennium Stadium. >> Oh [\h__\h] So we play War in there and we beat him.

I scored first try Super League like cuz we got first game up and all games were there that weekend. >> So like [\h__\h] hell like >> you know what I mean? >> Off to a flyer. Yeah. Like all the all the sacrifices and all that training all that preseason off seasonason having a bre >> you know like yes main you know and we start after that one game started talking about like a new contract and like a lot better money and all that stuff. um week after we played. So that one was Saturday. We played we had we had Cass on Sky at Cass.

The following Friday, so six days later went to that started that game again and that went like the rangy chase and all them players. Um 10 minutes in I like dizzy couldn't see like [\h__\h] hell. I'm just not ready yet. So they had to bring me off put me on oxygen after like 15 minutes into game. I said I'm not I'm not right.

Like something's not right. Went for had a checkup and that's when they found out about me my me my heart that I needed um my doctor told I had to retire basically. >> Yeah. What's so what what happened with your heart? >> So I were born I was born with iotic stenosis. So basically >> your iota valve your main valve in your heart mines. I was born with a narrow a narrow valve. >> So it was always like mild.

So it was slightly narrowed compared to maybe a a normal person's heart valve. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Um so I used to go for like yearly checkups when I would get it like every four years cuz it were really mild. When I got to 16 I went pro. They were like you're putting your heart out under some strain now. We want to check it every single year.

So you just get it checked and it were always fine. It were always all right. Like yeah it's not changed. Your ball's all right. It's doing well.

You're fit. You're looking after yourself. But and then obviously after that preseason and all training on >> you reckon that's what it was just overtrained do you reckon or >> I don't know I don't know if it just a matter of it >> time >> time and time or is it a coincidence I didn't have a bre and you muscle in a day >> is that a >> there's such thing as overt training but obviously if you're already >> so sort of you're already handicapped with it weren't you >> in a in a sense you know what I mean you you were already a disadvantage with that I think things we saw it here. >> No, >> they just you asked >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Wow. Okay. >> Yeah.

So, ultimately I went to leads for a checkup and they basically said to operate you could retire today, not play again or like just got a mortgage. I think Alex Matt had just been born at that point. So, I had two kids at age 20. Just got a mortgage. I thought I had no else.

I've just wanted to play rubbish since I was five. >> Yeah. >> So, we're like what do I do? >> No income. think [\h__\h] hell like what's next? So I said I need a second opinion here. They said well and then at least they went the only way you can operate is >> crack your sternum >> and then change your valve in your heart to a pig's valve. But obviously without to crack your sternum playing rubby after that it wouldn't have been doable. So if I had a non-cont sport >> tennis player or whatever they would have crack me in because I'm not there's no impact. >> So I like well that's not an option.

I might as well just not have it done and just retired from if I'm >> gr I could have lived with that valve. It just cuz I were pushing it to play professional. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> So I got a second opinion down in London. Um and surgeon surgeon I saw if you remember the footballer who had that cardiac arrest on pitch for Tottenham a few years back. He got first footballer like to have the big I think he had on pitch in the he survived it like >> Yeah. >> Oh is that where he just dropped in the touch? >> Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, I remember seeing that >> quite a few years back like and um basically the surgeon that sent me to was the same surgeon that looked after me. So yeah, I know we're going to right hands. >> Yeah. >> And I went to see him and he just basically said, "Yeah, I can go in your rib. We'll sort of like cut you down here to get in your rib. We'll have to split your sternum and we'll be able to get you back playing in six to nine months." >> So is it good? jobs are good and like it only that valve will probably last from a sport who perform like to perform probably about 10 years like I always love like surgeons and speak like mechanics you know like the high-end ones like we'll just cut you there go in there you off you go it's like like changing a spark plug like you know like every day he's going to be messing about me chilled out >> it's actually scary how chilled out there like anytime in hospitals My when my daughter were born early and obviously she were in the pod.

It it looked [\h__\h] insane. Yeah. Like she were that big in this woman like sipping a cup of tea while she's injecting her and it was like are you not scared about like breaking or whatever? Like oh no it's fine. Everyone does this. >> Have you ever se have you ever seen that video with that with a heart surgeon?

Skill heart surgeon them two little metal clippers and he's making like that um paper goose mate. It's unbelievable. Honestly, I wish you were capable of doing edits on screen because I'd have it on, mate. Or >> PTSD. >> I swear it's mad as hell. It's like origami like he's making all his thing and he makes like um like a swan or something out of paper and he's like that with an art surgeon doing it.

But >> I'd have really struggled as a surgeon. I have a really [\h__\h] operation just like I just hit the side and [\h__\h] throw it like >> Yeah. Go on. Then they also obviously went to see him and he went, "Yeah, I can crack on with it." So had that done in that in that time OD release me. So that was sort of that obstacle there where I'm like [\h__\h] like but luckily okay are coming for me on a better deal than I draw before cuz obviously I' I'd proven that I could play. >> Yeah. >> Obviously was subject to me getting back from a major operation which I was starting for again starting at a new club. >> Yeah.

Yeah. >> I were a bit older. I'd played quite a few games now at that point. >> Yeah. But I still want I won't say I are an experienced or a porn first tamer. Do you know what I mean here? So I still get I still want proven you know coming back coming off back of major art surgery.

So yeah signed fully art in 2012 I think it was. Yeah. >> What were the recovery like for them? I mean I know they said six to nine months but what what did that involve? Were it just said you don't you can't do anything or what type of physio did you have? What was the comeback from that? >> So obviously I was sore but I got out I got I got home from London and then after about a week they said I need to start like walking.

So I remember walking around old estate. I getting out of breath. I like [\h__\h] it. I said I said some we're going home to miss someone's not ready. I said like it turned out that I had a leak.

So like there's like a bag around there's like a bag of fluid around your heart that protects it >> and that bag of fluid go full. So there a leak there a leak where they operated. So I had to go back in then. >> Oh my god. >> I had to go back in for that for that draining. So we had to do another operation and drain that bag and obviously make sure that that leak cuz that leak probably has stopped but because it it filled that bag up that day having pressure on me. That's why I when I walking but after a week I should have been able to walk. >> Yeah. >> Like even >> lucky you went out for walk though it really would have that would have been would it have been major consequences if if >> Yeah. because obviously >> yeah so unless we were walking I probably wouldn't wouldn't have felt it I' just been leged out you know like but it >> yeah so I went back in for for that releasing and then probably I can't remember what were probably I think after about 3 months I could start getting me heart rate up slowly on bike and stuff >> you know but I I like sort of monitoring me out rate all the time I had we still getting paid for club at this point or >> yeah well so basically I were contracted for that full year at Hersfield and this one at the start of the season.

So basic when I had my operation done like they paid me out until end of season like yeah I come to an agreement and got like a lump sum payout and then I in that time I'd sign my new deal to start in November at all. So I didn't go any time without getting paid. >> Yeah >> cuz obviously I was contract and saladed like but um yeah so I did a bit to be fair I just feel pretty good like physio class there so after operation even though I'd been paid out I still went in there to do a bit of rehab because obviously I won't start okay well at November. So I used to go in got bike and that and he in he stand with me with tracking me out all that >> and I just sort of gradually built it up and then but when I start so I had that done in can't month I had it done in it start to middle of year anyway it might be March or April time I had operation started there in November all miles off >> there. Yeah. So they're all coming back.

I think some of them players have probably gone straight through training straight >> like I did previously >> just to come back firing and like to prove a point. >> Yeah. >> But I'd come back off back a major art surgery. So like honestly I will I will tow him. But to be fair like >> fair enough though. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Great. Don't kick yourself.

You have had heart surgery twice. >> I um like in scheme of things now I do think back honestly like on a I do think that my career could have probably gone to another level if it weren't for that art. >> Yeah, >> 100%. >> But as much as I I still did all right and I'm a decent player. >> Yeah. >> I were never as fit as I as all previously >> never reached that full potential with it. >> Is there a part of the like I'm not a fake kind of person? Like I don't say, you know, there's a reason why it's happened. I try not to anyway because you can just sort of give yourself a way out at all the time. Yeah. >> But do you not feel like that was like the universe's way of saying this ain't your path >> maybe >> I I'm do you know I would feel think it's same thing when you said that funny enough but I'm pretty big on that as well but um like you just said it's which way you want to look it but I don't know you what your look on that is. >> You could you could say that it's because I do say to people >> in hindsight. >> Yeah in hindsight. So coming on Toolkit obviously that first year when I write off again I think I played one or two games. >> Yeah. >> Sort of miles off miles off like fitness wise, physical wise.

It took me a good 12 when So it probably took me 18 months really to probably get something like that >> I could compete. Do you know what I mean? And then like the second year so I signed a two-year deal. The second year I did all right and I got fit. um play played quite a lot of games and I signed another two-year deal. Um but 6 months into that second year deal, OKR signed two new lookers who sort of went above me.

Even though they'd signed me on a new two-year deal, these became available and they signed them. So like right 25 26 still chasing dream. >> Yeah. >> What do I need to do? >> Yeah. Which looking back in hindsight now, I wouldn't be from a business point of view. If I'd have still been chasing that dream in that bubble, >> yeah, >> as a fringe first team player of doing all right on >> Yeah. >> on an half decent salary, >> my I wouldn't have my business out today. >> So, I think as it happened, >> you know what I mean? Yeah. >> You I leave a full-time environment at 25 26. >> Obviously, at the time it were like, well, I signed for Sheffield semi-professional.

Yeah. Training on a night. I had to find something else to do. >> Yeah. >> Luckily, I got involved with what I do now. And that was sort of 10 years ago. >> Yeah. Look at me. >> Is that how long it's been now? 10 years. >> Not by myself.

So, obviously working for another company, self-employed, >> but it has been 10 years. >> What was that? From 2015ish. Yeah. So, I started ultimate shreds. >> Yeah. 2015. Like, >> but I think that leads on to the next bit then.

So, obviously you got a successful business now. I I I'd done me mortgage with you, didn't I? >> Yeah. So, um, yeah, anyone of if, uh, who doesn't know what what Ke does, he's going to explain now. But we're just trying to the reason why we're doing podcast today is to show from the sporting background, from professional athlete, what sort of traits that you take from that same mentality and put it over into your business. >> Yeah, >> I think um, obviously, so we do mortgages and we do life insurance, critical illness, income protection, all that kind of stuff. um anything from financial sort of need really and think this from a sporting background and if that's I guess if that's professional amateur mid pro >> I think you carry trades like we all like sporting if it's you know it's not necessarily rugby it could be any sport >> obviously there's sacrifices you got to make and I think that for me that's one of the main ones >> sacrifice drive >> attitude do you know like and if you >> it does relate massively >> 100% I I don't think it needs to even be sport does it you know like we were talk we were just saying before the podcast like people just turn up to gym all the time it shows what kind of character you are that discipline consistency and that's the key in it over time and how you keep coming back whether little setbacks or major setbacks whatever it is um I think it it just builds you like I said earlier just mold you into the person you are whether it be in business or your sport and I think they all correlate between each other >> I think it like creates a little bit difference um someone said it to me the other day like most People are what's called a summertime runner. So when it's nice, shiny, and bright, they'll get the shoes on, they'll go out for a run.

But when it's dark and dreary and cold, they'll stay inside. And it translates to business. When everything's going great, money's coming in, you're happy, you're the best business person ever. But when it all gets tougher, you know, it's called the valley of despair. When you get to that point where it's either put up or shut up, there's a bit of pressure.

You need to make sure you're getting that wage that month. make sure you're scaling. It's a real challenge to actually bring yourself back and go, "Right, this is where I need to bring it out the bag and work." And I think obviously what everything that you've been through, you're finding it very it's probably easier like I think me and you work better when we're under pressure. >> Yeah. >> I always found that some of our best business directions came from a point where this isn't working. We need to change something. That's how it evolves. >> Yeah. >> Is that the same for you? >> I think. Yeah.

I think when your back's against wall and I think that's the different mentality like there's probably some some people in the same business that I do and they're happy fing along. >> Yeah. >> Like earning a half decent wage >> might there might be them and their administrator. >> Yeah. >> It's like I've got it I've got main inside me. I just want >> Is that competitive drive though? I I put that to competitive drive and being used to being in a competitive field all the time. same >> like I've got we get we've got staff now and obviously advisor there's not many there's like six of us but >> we have like a board every month >> got it at the target >> yeah and no but we have we have a see who can bring most money in like >> and I'm like [\h__\h] I win it every sing which I'm going to do cuz I'm you know I've been doing it longest yeah it's not about that but it's more like we have a bit of banter with it you'll lovely >> you want something Sunday something to try >> we had to we had it written that board for for a while though didn't we all for for the year and stuff like that. But it's a good uh it's a good way to >> I don't know. And you you probably a lot of people saying like I I just can't sit and be happy.

Like I've never >> Yeah, mate. We should do We should We should do that with like a bonus cash thing at the end of it. Me, you, and Harry. >> Yeah. >> And do it genuinely. See who gets most names in. And then whoever wins it just Well, well, end of day it's money to money in it because the more people you get in, the more money you pay, the more >> first wins, everyone wins, don't they? >> Yeah.

Yeah. But you it's funny because when you talk about competitive nature I think when it comes to business as well it's nice being a competitive field like we're starting to realize now that for every conversation we have a potential learner they've spoke to other providers and we're all we actually sounded quite desperate to start with like yeah but if you come with us we'll give you this and you and now we've got this mentality where listen if you don't want to work with us there you go it's fine don't worry about it and I And that's when you realize that the value in your business is a lot higher cuz it's like listen we know what we can do and we know what we can provide. It's up to you whether you choose us, but I promise you you're not going to get what we >> I think the reputation builds such as yourself, especially around here. Like everyone knows you around here for doing it, don't they? >> Coming back to that as well, like I like I proper what you said then because like going back five years when I started car find out yourself like by myself. So I made the jump from another company to do it by myself.

Like I'd get people coming back say, "Oh, I've seen this rate and with this blended or this poker or whatever." And I used to try and fight for it and man like >> I know for a fact our service is second to none. >> Yeah. >> Like >> you're going to be updated. You're going to you know and it's from a service point of view. Yeah. >> And your client journey is going to be >> not saying better than going with somebody else but can guarantee you're going to have a good journey with us or you could be a client for life. >> So I'm like take I'm like literally I'm a bit >> I feel like >> believe it like I ain't got to beg anybody. I'm like proven now sort of thing. So, and and I back that up and you and if we don't if we don't back it up, >> yeah, >> we'll always hand up and say, "Look, we we messed up then." Oh, we we provided the service.

But up to now, we've had no complaints and we've been >> Yeah. I think over over time, even your reviews, whether it Trust Pilot, word of mouth, I think that's what speaks the most volume though in it. people who've experienced it like >> the whole experience itself from first phone call to when they get the house or they get converted to be a PT the experience is what people talk about >> and you only got to get one person who's I don't know you get a woman who's a hairdresser at times she's got loads of they all want to talk to each other then they tell the man they want to get into it and I think it just keeps growing and growing I think that's that stands for any any self-employed business doesn't it >> of course it does yeah of course it does I think that um yeah I think it's just a matter of keeping that upload you know what I mean I think going back to before you could get to a certain level and think >> I'll relax a bit now. >> Yeah, >> you've slug off today and you >> coming back on me and my in the day and the same you >> I've been going and studying mate. I've um I've been self-employed since I think I was 2011. I think I've been self-employed since I was 17. And it's crazy though how good it can be.

Everything going in your favor. Life's good. You feel like you've made it and then all of a sudden buffing you back if you don't keep on it uh or keep your same mentality or you start living a bit more of a high life. And I I got one point when all over all the world I woke up in morning I sort of edit overnight. crazy all over the world. I had a big and then I got that many people in the team doing all the jobs when I literally lost where everything was. >> Yeah. >> Like and I was almost sat at back like we were this massive corporate business and everyone's doing it for me and I was just waiting for money to come in and when you realize then you're the face of it you like if you took a backseat now. >> Yeah.

Yeah. That's >> like I did that I thought see it. I'm done. The company's bigger than the name but in actual fact like everyone used to seeing me on the video. Of course it is.

Yeah. Of course it is. when you when you did it yourself from from day one, that's what people associate your face to it. And then when there are different people on it, the it's just not the same look. So that quickly can go from >> best times of your life to uh chasing it again. Then then once that waters under bridge, it's hard to get it back if if there's any loss in reputation through I mean probably like you said my mistakes in oh my through business >> from starting like my own business like just me in kitchen like working 18 20our days.

Well, you going to say 4:00 a.m. in Kitchen. That's where all the best cuz it's a start. >> But um 18 20our days and then obviously >> I have got more >> I don't know me time management's got better over time >> and I've used getting a few staffing and Anna's messes now. She's doing mortgages and it sort of techs the face of it >> but I'm not like running around like chicken. can see me daughter sometimes like >> she's not saying dad you're on your laptop all the time or you're on your phone all the time. So I think that time management I think you've got to find that you've got to find that balance. >> So some work life balance here >> but but still I know some weeks if I've got to be honest like >> the duality is always different with a work life balance because I've had this many conversations with many different business owners and we've talked about it loads and >> you know you you feel a sense of guilt sometimes. I I know I feel guilt when I've got to work that extra few hours on a night or I know that to get that monthly wage in I've got to complete this and then you're trying to build another business in the background and you're trying to put this and put that.

You got a lot of plates spinning. Your your mind gets very engulfed in what you do. And for me it's a passion like it like I think when you've got a career that you built it's it's who you are. Yeah. And I think if you take all that away, I can like I've had conversations with people like what what if you just step out that and just get a normal job.

If I did this now, if I stepped away from everything and went and got a normal job, I would be a completely different person. Like I'd lose all my sense of purpose. >> So I think time management is a difficult one. I think that just takes time to figure that out. And also you need to like sort of give yourself a bit of a break sometimes cuz you lose that creative momentum. Do you know what happens when I get good at time management, I do something else. >> That's my That's my problem.

Like I get stuff going and I'm like everything's going good and it's never enough. That's my one >> bad trait is I've had to close businesses recently because it just gets too much. And then still going chasing that dream, mate. I still I've just come back for boxing now 32, mate. Like one last run.

It's like you going back at rubberfield now going one more go. Come on. That's what I've done. That's what That's what I've done, mate. And uh I left it long and all the way through lockdown.

My first attempt to go professional was uh January 2020 when went into lockdown in uh March 2020 and that when I just got the gym just got um January 2020 got the my first gym. February moved into my first house. March lockdown, April I was born and then it went and then I got the online company in the in what it May. Yeah, May. I turned it online.

So and then obviously it went good there. sort of put it on back burner and then realize I want no regrets when I get old. So I'm back. But I think it's all still same mentality no matter what it is. You're always climbing, always searching. You can have time like work life balance, but it's how much you want to chase it.

That's what we said. Especially when you're early in your I don't know entrepreneurish career or whatever whatever you want to call it or self-employed business. There's got to be an element of massive sacrifice, hasn't there? >> Well, I had a meet of a guy last week and he's um multi-millionaire like and he going back to that like I think if you got them traits like I'm I'm a go-getter like you know what I mean? >> Yeah. I've got drive and >> I I'll never just sit back. Yeah.

I get I've got to sort of work my time management out. But so basically this guy he um he had a company worth absolute millions um lost it all at one point and now he's built like he's I say lost it all he lost the business but he's still a very wealthy man. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> And he's like that will fruit space like a 25 30 year period and now obviously he's a bit more on in life and he was saying it's instilled in me like and we we sort of bounce off each other because he could see traits that >> Yeah. Yeah. sort of saying you instilled in us to open it. is like you had a work ethic and like you just love way I do a proper good coffee >> and he's like um he said I try and change but he said it's not I'm never he said if you've got that in you >> it's going back to the sporting or people turning up to gym or how how does it how does it correlate to to business it massively does because I think if you've got that instilled in you >> y >> it's just finding the the way to get it out you know what I mean >> and I'm always like I I must have come at one point in my life every six months one family was to come up with million dollar ideas, you know what I mean? Like just everything I did, I were like, "Yep, this is the one now." Like putting numbers together, I'd be like, "Oh god, we've made it." But when it does take one, I mean, I'm not there yet.

I'm still uh still coming up with these ideas, but again, chasing this dream even um like that. What was the other one you've got as well? Whatever if it all works out. I think that's unless you create your own opportunity in your life, don't you? Don't matter what it is, uh you never know how good it's going to be or what about it. >> Yeah.

Yeah. And I I seen I see a quote yesterday says, "What about if it turns out better than you've ever imagined?" >> You know, I can't do that. >> Yeah. So that the quote said, "What about if it turns out better than you imagined?" And >> I think for me, that's what I'm looking at with with a pro career for the boxing is it's setting up me future life, whether it be the coaching. Like I've just been asked to go to um go over to America to to corner. >> Oh, good. Yeah. >> Um in March, 28th of March for Mark Tiffin.

So um I can't remember what place is called now. Right. when I'm right weird name ones but I'm going I'm flying over there so again it's already started that career but I can be a coach forever I can't be a fighter forever and I still miss being in the limelight like no matter how much I just can't like when I was when I was sat out from that and the businesses were growing and I would just onto cornering and you get pushed out to the side a little bit once it's all done and dusted like although you played a massive part in it you never did the big part so uh which is note on them like go and enjoy it enjoy your celebrations they deserve it but I always just missed that little of done it like you want to get to >> we're not we're not early 20s anymore and you don't want to you don't want to 40 50 and older think what if >> and I think that's one for me like >> I think it always scared me and I don't know if it's the same for you but living in Ponty especially >> I could go out now to all the same pubs I used to go out as a kid and see the same people in there drinking the same type of pine complaining about the same things in the same job and it just like I've always got this fear that you're going to die the exact same way as you've always lived. And to some people that's fine. And I'm not speaking for everybody, but I think you've got to try something to leave a mark. And it doesn't have to be a big man.

I'm not saying you want to be remembered by everybody. You want to be in the history books, but do something that makes you remarkable in your own way. >> Yeah. >> For me, probably same got kids in it now. Like it's making a I want a better long-term future for my consultant. Yeah. And do you know about trail? >> Do you know like even if me success didn't go out when I wore this millionaire I dreamed of since I were a young kid. >> I think the way your kids look at you >> inspire >> is is the main main thing.

They see how hard you tried. It don't matter. You chased a dream. >> Yeah. >> But like I could go and get a permanent job somewhere, make loads of money and be Yeah. But like I want to be able to tell the story and say this is what I did. I enjoyed doing it.

And like my dad always says I was going to beat stacking boxes. Like he says that all the time now. And although my dad's always done well, he said he didn't do what he wanted to wanted to do. So, um, I've always lived by that. And >> it's like you're doing doing something you want to do, you know?

Yeah. >> And like you said, you never know. It could be six months, six years or six. >> You don't you only you're only one conversation away from your life changing, aren't you? And that's it. You need to someone like such as this podcast, as silly as it sounds. I've just done we've done this because I love it.

I listen to podcasts every day. Like literally every day. I don't even like listen to music anymore because it's just on it gym 24/7. And so when I get my me time, listen to podcasts. So doing this like a hobby for me.

But like you have one conversation, it gets on right thing and all of a sudden then you start been you start scaling and it's >> that's the one thing good about this is that there's no plan to scale it. >> That's what's fun. Going and just having these conversations as a I love it. >> We just got to do what we do every day. It's sit with people and talk [\h__\h] And I think as a PT that's the dream. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. But what a like what a story mate. Obviously >> I did not know any of that.

Wait, it's not done yet. So, if you're all right talking about it, kill um we're going to the next bit. Obviously, massive admiration for like what you've had to do already and go through and um but obviously like we said it's obstacle 10, I think. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah.

So, yeah. Again, it's not I say this on I do some videos with work and that and just to get it out there, but >> yeah. None of it's a so story and I'm Yep. It's nothing, you know, like I just I'm just open, you know what I mean? So, business is up and down.

I I'll say that like it might look good on social media all the time. >> Yeah, we all know that. Yeah. 100%. 100%. >> Weeks you go thinking [\h__\h] >> Yeah. Oh, no. >> Clicks into place. You're like, "Yeah, thank God for that." >> Keep chasing that, don't you? That's what you're chasing it.

Them good weeks. Yeah. Yeah. >> Then you have adversity and it's going to happen all times. But yeah, so sort of last year while sort of a bit like up and down from a business point of view. So this year sort of getting into January, I'm like this is the year.

Yes, >> this is the year we've done well. We've had this growth. This year we're going to continue that growth and sort of without any of that adversity that's that's crept in sort of changing processing background of the business and and all that kind of stuff. I've got Anna doing the mortgages because time management were a big one like I said before. So I just were like a headless chicken running around all the time.

So I sort of had to sort of take a back step so I could oversee business a bit more. So start at the start of year everything sort of going all right and then we get to we get to May. Um overnight I turned my eyes turned yellow so like right I was falling a bit tired so went to bed not Monday Tuesday Tuesday Tuesday wake up brush my teeth thought a little bit oh yeah I know again a blow didn't think over didn't say yeah >> Wednesday Alex had a game at scholarship for Liga so I drove over there to watch him and then he come over after game to the sideline and s he just looked at me dad your eyes thought he's noticed. So I got back, went straight to hospital. Long story short, I wouldn't pin the fields a week.

They couldn't find out what were causing me to be ill, but my levels on my blood test were not right basically. Um so it turned out that um I had a blockage of some some kind in the bile duct which was stopping toxins getting out of my liver. So it were getting backed up into my bloodstream making me jaundice. >> No. saw that right got out went to went to Nfield with my private healthcare and it turned out I had a tumor on my pancreas. Oh [\h__\h] it's pressing on my on my bile duct that's closing it. So obviously it's the fire sort of stuck in it initially but the note stuck in it actually had the tumor there pushing and blocking my bile duct.

So you had to put a stand in my buck to open it back up which obviously why I look normal. Um but this tumor was cancerous. Oh Jesus. >> Obviously from a from it start of the year where I'm like this is the year sort of overcome all [\h__\h] [\h__\h] past like and then obviously all this all this happened. So between sort of May and now it's sort of been hospital appointment scans. Um I've had a massive surgery already which didn't go to plan.

They couldn't they couldn't take the tumor out. So to this day now I had a scan Friday just gone. Um just waiting me appointment now to see what see what's next. So, but again like still positive like you know >> I'm not just going to >> Well, you got to be I've had a cold for the last week and it's [\h__\h] like you've got to just look forward but yeah that's yeah that's insane. I mean so what do you know the next steps yet?

I know you said you were waiting for that next consultation but is there a battle plan or what? Not yet. Not. >> Is Has anybody cuz I know how strong you are as a character anyway and just as a person in general, but has anyone tried to like tiptoe around you at work or you about to make it like clear like look just treat me normal or is it like >> I've had some people like you know you see them and they like >> they ask you. Yeah. >> Not like you can tell they want to say how you do >> getting on >> and I'm like I sometimes try to make a conversation because see that they're having awkward sub. It must be awful as a bloke as well cuz no matter what's wrong with us it's like you got a tumor it's like yeah I'm fine >> yeah I'm sound that's why I've put the videos out there as well I have to say look >> yeah yeah >> I'm not packing up shop I'm not laying at home every day feeling sorry for myself I feel all right >> yeah I'm still going to train I'm still going to still going to turn to work I'm still going to graph like my life just going on as normal >> to a certain extent like the only things I'm doing different is going for these appointments obviously after operation like obviously I was I had made a major surgery which when I woke up from that I should have woke up with that tumor gone and have my pancreas missing but I'd have been I'd have been cancer free >> obviously it wasn't to be again so yeah >> what are the next steps is basically said there's a lot of different things they can do it's it's a really rare type so it's an hormonal based cancer so like chemotherapy won't work for it but there is a lot of things but because it's that rare there's not as much studies into it >> yeah as some of the younger generation sort of gets Um but yeah, I guess it's just a matter of >> Did they say how long it's you? >> They reckon you've had it >> potentially four or five year >> really background.

Yeah. >> And that only then you start getting symptoms. I need to get checked out. >> But ultimately because it's it's called nonfunctional. Uh so basically that means there's no side effects. >> So if it was like your pancreas like ed pancreas and you got a tail of your pancreas, the bile ducts here. So my tumor is in ed of your pancreas. I could have had it in tail which I'd have never known about it. >> Well, >> if it weren't pushing on my bile duct, there'd have been no way of finding out because it's nonfunctional. >> So, it's a blessing really. >> Yeah.

Which would >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> They found it like saying it sounds stupid saying this early even though it been there four or five years. >> Yeah. >> In the in the scheme is a really slow growing type. >> Yeah. >> So, four or five years is because usually because it's nonfunctional, they find it 10 or 15 years in. >> Yeah. But obviously in my head I'm like I won't I won't redo it. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Did you find it hard explaining it to kids? >> Audible. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Like I still do you know like it's one of them. >> Did you brave face around people and I can't talk about >> Yeah.

Yeah. And I'm swear to you. >> It's like it's the first thing you worry about. >> Yeah. Or like you know if I'm just driving by myself. >> Yeah. Like [\h__\h] it. just keep saying ends your English. So like you don't like talking about um just something you just don't expect to happen at 35 year old. >> You never expect it to happen to you until you >> No. >> Is it one in two get it too?

Obviously like >> I think with a job that I do. >> Yeah. Yeah, but in short I've had a conversation with you about the critical and that do you know what I mean? And it's it just >> that would be I couldn't get it. >> Oh, no way. >> So because of me issue they give me life cover all but I I I could get live cover. So Anna's got life and critical illness like like you got and you you men's got but I only get live cover. I got declined for critical illness cover by everybody.

So obviously if I don't have that >> how bad's that though that they they do that >> yeah because they know >> well they're going to say we're not covering that but ele >> no coral to that >> I've I've even had that and I mean the smallest smallest ever version of that with um I think it was me me hands cuz I broke broke me hands so there were no boxing that that wouldn't show me for >> Yeah. Yeah. >> me hands at times. Yeah. Yeah. Exclusion at hands. >> Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. which could have excluded but >> I guess cuz it's quite a major thing that they might think your body's weaker or more immune to getting over that and I don't know but nobody would touch it match you lifting 50 and here like give him some insurance he's fine >> no >> that's yeah that's crazy I think well >> like a sub story in it >> no but it's not like a sub story I think >> I think the the story all together, mate. It's brilliant. And like you still how you how you're going on with your business the same. And that's like what, like I said, what it were about today.

Just I didn't actually know all of these other bits as well. Obviously, I I knew it briefly. And like it like you said, it's not something that you'd want to bring up straight away. Like uh we you know, I go around telling Yeah. I'm happy to share him. >> Yeah. somebody can if somebody gets diagnosed or something that can inspire in any any area, shape or form or go through some [\h__\h] do you mean? >> Yeah.

Well, I think some people I mean you can always say there's always someone worse, isn't there? But um I think to a to some to some size like you've got to believe that as well. Yeah. Obviously people might have got something going on now. It's nowhere near as bad as what you're to go through and be probably the same scaling upwards but forward. >> Yeah.

Yeah. That's what I mean mate. So, um I think there there's got to be an element of that that you got to imply to your life in there and like you said, it'll hopefully inspire someone then be like, well, okay, he won't stop. So, >> no is like >> when when that point is when I get other side of it, >> yeah, >> I'll be like [\h__\h] get in. Do you know what I mean?

And that's my mentality again. I'm just can't wait to >> get through this stage still. We're still doing all right stuff like and that's that's what more I was scared of the downturn from that cuz that's my livelihood. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Like and again going back to the face a bit. >> That's why I made it clear. Look, I'm still here. >> Yeah. >> I don't want Boomer to get around that I've got this tumor that >> Oh, you can't ring because we'll be putting on him like >> like we need you.

You know what I mean? That's what I sort of that's the reason why I got it out there from a on the company page and stuff. >> Yeah. That just for that reason really. >> That's Yeah. I mean, it's just a testament to the type of mindset you've got and I think that speaks to everybody because, you know, no ma no matter what's going on in your life and people can have some really difficult times, but whether it's business or life, you got to keep going. Like, you can't just stop and feel bad about it.

I mean, all all the bad things that you could think about happening in your life, just go for the good parts. And I think that's that seems like what you're doing. I think that's just a testament to who you are, what obviously you've been through. But >> I think um on there, mate, is um where where can people find you for your for your business? Have you got Facebook page, Instagram page, website?

You you tell you tell everyone where to find you. >> Yeah. So we got Facebook, um Instagram, I'm a LinkedIn. Um and obviously we're based in Ponte on Southgate, so can't miss big. >> Yeah. And um >> is it all under the same name? >> Yeah. Yeah.

All the same name. Yeah. Yeah. But just call it just just to finish like on >> Yeah. No gun just on just to tie you guys in.

I think from a elf and sort of training perspective like I know it's instilled in me to train and make myself cuz that's what I did previous to business. But I've gone through stages throughout building the business where I made excuses that I'm too busy. I'm too busy with work. I can't get to the gym. I can't I'm eating [\h__\h] because I'm too busy. >> Yeah. >> After me operation like this talking six weeks ago I got told it could be a three month recovery. four days later I had my laptop on Mickey through and mine busy going for a 10-minute walk on the morning within a week or back in office like I think but then soon as I could get back in the gym it's just like you need to go back to your gym even if you sit on bike and tick off for 15 minutes >> like I think >> getting out there be active >> you know getting that routine with if it's with a personal trainer or if you need that sort of >> they say they say trainers could biggest >> education out there Yeah, I don't go to gym for even couple of days, never mind deleting.

Sometime it's rolled into last couple of years maybe I've had two or three months off and I get to the stage where I'm a massive bro. >> And I think I think that's the point as well with I've just I've just trained someone this morning asked him if he's still going to gyms. H I just didn't have a bit of motivation for a couple of weeks. I like that's the thing is you need to just train anyway. Do it anyway. Do little's better than nothing.

Uh just turning up say I just sometimes you have your best sessions as well. like it's the discipline to keep turning up and then you will have a little bit of feeling of guilt then when you stop doing it and I think that's the best thing to have is to train that that much that becomes part of your routine when you when you do miss them some days then there's an element of guilt. >> Yeah. >> Same when you've got bad eating habits you know it's not right but you've got to have had a time where you're trying to eat better. >> Yeah. >> Or at least some knowledge in in nutrition. And then same with your training as well because you'll know then you'll know once you get back into it then you can start upping it again. But it's getting back in the gym and I think me mentality wise uh best thing for your mental health is is been in gym. >> Well it is true like even if some days like cuz I've been obviously going through a bit of [\h__\h] like I've just been turning up. I might go walk back home and then just go for a coffee. But do you know like just Yeah. around people who's in that same environment, you know, like Yeah.

And out out your four walls, you know, like I think you just it's easy to fall in that rope. >> Yeah. 100%. >> All done. You know what? >> Yeah. We we do it with every member and every client, every learner to be honest. >> Um we try and get people in as much as possible. It's not just so we can keep a business going, >> but you know, if you're ever feeling like you're isolated and alone or whatever, >> you can find a tribe in a gym. You can find a tribe in health and fitness.

And no matter how long you've been away, you come back, you're welcome. And I think that's the most important thing about health and fitness. You've always got a place there. >> Yeah. >> Do you uh is there anyone I've not really I've not really asked this to anyone before actually. So, is there anyone you think that'd be good for this podcast? anyone you can think off the top of your head who might do it or who's got a decent story or I actually got asked this on podcast I went on. Yeah, luckily I know some fighters and stuff so it would be quite easy for me but just cuz we've everything we've done on this podcast we've asked if anyone knows anyone or we just got to go off back people I know or whatever or we we'll do a little search inside and find some people or we'll go who does anyone want to see or not put your suggestions on.

Obviously we're not that that level yet. I I'll tell you somebody I went on his podcast but >> yeah this is what I was thinking >> right >> Quinton does work for us rock >> right >> oh yeah yeah yeah that that sounds good >> I'll know it's your time come visit us >> let's go we're going to start doing a nomination but end ice bucket comes out what the book nomin >> right mate thank you girl mate we'll leave you that Thank you everybody. As always, like and subscribe. We'll see you next time.