How We Scaled PT Launch Lab Courses — with Sam, Merve EdTech

this live. Sorry. Well, >> yes. All right. Hello everybody.

Hope all doing well. So, today I'm with Sam. He's the owner of Axel and MV Edtech. And we're going to go over a little bit about his business, what he's doing, and also how he finds PT and what he looks for in a PT. But we're going to be covering a lot today.

So, tune in, subscribe, like, and keep watching the videos. Hello mate. How we doing? >> Yeah, not bad. So, not too bad. >> Bit of a weird situation for us nowadays. We We're just used to talking [\h__\h] during a >> dec Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Come in for a PT session, get sweaty, and talk nonsense. Yeah, >> that is what PT is. >> Yeah, basically. >> But, uh, walk me through a little bit about who you are, what you do, let the viewers know. >> Yeah. So um yeah it's it's it's a weird question now who I am um but uh essentially founder of of Axel and MV um I used to build edtech products um back in um from for many years build them all from scratch >> used to build for big companies work with like Cartoon Network and Disney and all those sort of big brands >> um and you know obviously they they'd all sort of pay a fortune for this sort of stuff.

We had a lot of people coming in sort of saying, "Hey, look, you know, I'm a startup. I've got no money, but I've got a great idea. It's going to make millions." Um, and to be fair, there was a lot of rubbish that came in, but there were some people that would come in, and I genuinely believed they would be able to make a difference in education. Um, but because they've got no money, they couldn't spend sort of, you know, hundreds of thousands of pounds on this sort of software. Um, I thought it's a real shame that they're not able to get started and and get the sort of tools that they need.

Um, and that's where that the idea for MV came along where I thought if I could just build it and we for all these big products we were building the same thing like if you sort of strip away the sort of the paint on the front end >> at the very back and you've seen Mer where you can just sort of customize that is ultimately what we were doing for these big brands but because they were buying the whole thing from scratch we'd build the whole thing every single time. >> So I thought right I'm just going to build the backend piece and that's going to be great. So, uh, we did that. Um, and, uh, we went live. Um, you were the first person that went live on the platform. Um, and I was in my videos, I talk about how you just want to get out there and get started because the reality is that people, even if you're not perfect, there will be people that will still want what you're offering.

And if you're being transparent about where you're at and what you're doing and and you're just an honest and genuine bloke, I think >> that that is enough because at that point people can say, "Well, no, I want someone who's, you know, I mean, I want something that is absolutely perfect." And in that case, you can say, "Right, well, fair enough." Because if you lie about that, you're just going to go down into a road of disappointment, upset, bad reviews, bad, you know, just people will just get to know people talk, right? So, but if you're honest, and I was with you when I said, "Look, you're going to be the first person that's going to go on. there's going to be problems. Um, without a doubt, you've got my WhatsApp, give me a call, let me know. And I think that also translates with any business, right? Even if you're a PTM, maybe you know this, right?

When you when when when you're getting started, if you're just honest about who you are, where you're at in your career, I think that builds right from the get-go, a bit of a genuine connection and something that, you know, everyone's expectations are all at the same level. >> Yeah. People buy from people. >> Yeah. Absolutely. And it's a lot easier to get feedback, I think, when you you you've been honest at the start. If you say at the start, oh yeah, you know, to put it into PT context, oh, I've been a PT for 10 years, you know, I'm I'm the best PT in this, you know, in in in the 10 mile radius.

And then after your first session, you go, was that all right? Did I do okay? You know what I mean? They're going to go, >> well, what do you mean? >> Well, weird. I don't it don't matter what business you're in or whatever you do in terms of your career.

I think you're always going to have the sense of imposter syndrome but >> absolutely >> believing in your product. So it's like it's like you say people buy from people and if you're constantly trying to prove yourself to people. >> Yeah. >> I don't think the confidence is ever there rather than being upfront and say look we're a work in progress but we want to work with you. We want to build with you. And I think a lot of these big companies now miss out on the key thing of if you're not working with your customers like I imagine a lot of the big educational platform companies. So I'm not naming names but I used some in the past where if I had a particular issue and I got in touch with a support team and this is a very critical cause there's a lot going on >> they would come back with very broken solutions or they just say oh that that doesn't work because of this sorry and you know it wouldn't help whereas throughout the time I've had in MV edtech I've had constant support and also you've seen some ideas go oh actually we might develop this and move this on.

So, I think your approach of just saying, "Look, I'm a work in progress, but I need people telling me that stuff are wrong because >> I think you can almost get a little bit blindsided with your own product." >> Yes. >> Like you focus on the certain amount of quality, you'll miss out on some things and if no one's telling you those things are wrong, >> then you're never going to be able to improve the product. >> Absolutely. I think a lot I know a lot of people fall into that trap. So um again before this I was a startup consultant as well. So worked with a lot of people that got some investors in you know starting up their business start building their products. Um and a lot of them will fall into the trap of it's not perfect yet. >> Um so and and and and they would sort of they won't show it to anyone or get any feedback and spend an insane amount of time and money on a thing that they're just so caught up in their own heads about what they think is perfect. >> Yeah.

Um, and there was one in particular. It was about a year of building and tweaking and trying to perfect this thing. And after I think after the third month I was saying this is like you could go out to a couple of people with this. Just get some feedback. No, no, no, no.

Six months. Seriously, mate. Like this can definitely go to some people. Again, that transparency that's how you want to approach it. >> Got to the 12 month mark, went live, and guess what? It wasn't perfect.

He thought it was he was like this is exactly what I want. And then they went, >> "This is weird." Yeah. >> What is this? And it's like you you could have had that moment 9 months before now. >> Yeah. >> And you could have spent the last nine months just like just working on it, right? And just just improving and getting feedback. So yeah, I think that's that's the main difference.

And anyone that does come over to the the big products and we won't name names, but you do get that it is what it is. Or if if we're not for you, then go away, right? >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Uh maybe maybe someone else will will will add better products for you. And that's fine to do when maybe when you're when you're a bigger company. >> But the the advantage that obviously we've got now and I think a lot of people when you're starting out is this is your opportunity to to work and and try and find try and be different, right?

Try and try and actually solve a problem that nobody else is solving right now. >> And again, I think the same thing goes with PTs, right? If you're talking to your clients, I think a lot of PTs that have been out there for 10 years and whatever doing what are they doing. I think they're so I mean correct me if I'm wrong, but I think you still got the same problem where you kind of you get cemented into this is how I do it now. I've I've gone through that phase. >> Yeah, >> I'm I'm now on a day-to-day this is how I operate. If you don't like how I operate, that's totally fine.

Go elsewhere. But >> yeah, and that's what tends to happen with a lot of PTs now. So what tends to happen is they create their own bubble and how they do it is how it works, you know, when they're spreading information. This is the problem with social media, especially with when you're trying to teach people out there for exercise or nutrition or just even coaching skills. people get stuck in their own methods thinking that's the only thing that works rather than coming into it with an open mindset going no matter how long you've been doing this no matter how long you've been in this game there's always something to learn >> and I think that obviously plays a big role in your role as well because education the standards always change and the needs always change >> so when you how long did it take you to develop the like from wanting to do an educational platform to getting it on boarded. How long did it take you?

How long was the process? >> Um, well, I mean, it was a it was probably a couple of years of thinking about it, talking to people, um, and and just trying to figure out what that uh what that exact pain point is that we can deliver, right? What is the what is the bare minimum essentially that I need to be able to do in order to be valuable? Um and again we were doing a lot of consultancy at the time so it wasn't you know two years straight. It was when I get the opportunity to talk to someone that I think would would have some valuable information insight here. Um and then from starting to build it was exactly a year ago well not ex like roughly about a year ago now maybe more um when we started actually building it but we went live >> I want to say December last year or we >> No got into January didn't it? into the new year. >> Um, so it was about 6 months to build that first version and then obviously the last 6 months has been pretty like we've been on it and refining and pushing out updates um, constantly.

So >> yeah, you know, I think the latest update that we've just done now, I think that I'm personally quite happy with. I think that is is starting to take shape of what I had in my head at the start. >> Yeah. Yeah. Um, so I am pretty pretty proud of that and I think there's a lot more that we could do especially on the student side that's like that's where I really want to focus but we needed to make sure that obviously you know when you're building your your platform um that that that experience is good >> we're happy with that now I think um and then now we need to I think just versioning and stuff needs working on but uh the student experience is where I think there's a real advantage there because again this is kind of pointless and a lot of our competitors do this where maybe the the interface where you build your course and all that sort of stuff that's great but then when you actually look at the product that you're putting out there is fairly light and weak >> and I think if we can make that something that you can be proud of as a as a you know as one of our customers and and at the end of the day you're not selling the bit that we're selling right that that almost doesn't matter >> what what you want I think is is I want to have a product that I can be proud of that I can say to students this is amazing it's you know we've got the best tech platform out there. Um, and you know, it's got all these amazing things like, you know, an AI tutor, for example.

All that sort of stuff I think would just be great to to get in there and it's something that you can say that's your business. >> Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. >> So, I mean, if you think go to a bakery, um, it it's like, uh, you know, they're going to want the the the oven that's going to make the best bread. >> Mhm. >> They don't care about what your sales process is. They don't care about what your ordering process is. They don't care about the support to some degree, but really what that baker wants at the end of the day is really nice bread. >> Mhm. >> And I think for for any business, that's what you need to think about is what are people actually buying? >> Yeah. >> What are they actually getting as a result of it?

And and that's the bit that you want to sell. That's the bit that the the reason why they're coming to you. So I think for for you it's the courses and all of that sort of stuff. and that's fine. But it's that experience of the courses I think is is also key because they could go to a lot of providers out there and it might be you know starting off with oh uh come into a classroom we'll give you you know a packet of documents print off or whatever. Um and you've just created a lot of work for the students >> student experience then isn't great.

So it's how do we make and you know and that's what I'm thinking of is is what you want is you want that student experience to be really good. So then they go away and go I did this course. It was great. It was so easy. All I needed to do was sign up and blah blah blah, right?

Um they had, you know, all of this sort of stuff that helped me all along the way and um it was effortless. So yeah, I think and again with any business that's how you translate it, which is what is what does that end user that sort of end user experience look like and how do you make that better >> and if you can do that and and again the only way I think you can do that is by getting feedback. you can have an initial idea. Okay, I think this would be a good idea. But really, it's that open communication, I think, is is the key part. >> And it well, it just puts a lot of value in your product as well, cuz every time we've had a podcast when we're talking about even the sales side of things, you should never really have to give a price. It's more about you're selling the value rather than the ticket. >> Yeah.

Yeah, >> cuz like going back to a bakery, if you're walking to a bakery and there's two bakeries side by side and >> you're buying this certain bread and that's £3 and then the one next door is only >> £1, >> are you going to be swayed by the fact that well that bread's cheaper? Well, that this bread is nicer. It's been cooked longer. It's And it's even though the analogy is just about bread, it makes sense because when you're having these talks to your customers, to your clients, to whoever you're working with. >> If you immediately try and go for the price going, well, these guys charge this and we charge this, so you're already better off. >> Yes, that's better for the pockets, but in terms of value, like I would rather pay more for something that is going to give me exactly what I need. and more a lot of the time and also you're dealing with people and I think this is where you've got the advantage and this is where I think we've got the advantage as well as a course provider is when you get onto a lot of course providers or um educational platforms you're never really dealing with people you are dealing with chat bots email systems and you know it takes a long time to get through to a real person. >> Yeah. Whereas, right from what you said from the start, >> you're just a bloke.

You want to speak to people. You want to have those conversations because it not only improves your business, it just creates the relatability because everyone's trying to achieve something in that scenario. You're trying to scale your business and this client or student is trying to get qualified and trying to move on with their life. Yeah. And you both need to get something out of that otherwise what's the point having a business at all?

And I think that's why businesses struggle so much nowadays. They're trying to cut out that customer relation part. >> And just because it's easier, you're not actually going to scale because people like to buy from people. >> Absolutely. Yeah. And I think that's where, you know, there's going to there's going to be a shift. And there always is.

You know, you look at um so what one one analogy I always use quite a lot or more recently is if you've used Canva before, right? when canvas started can you imagine what was what they were facing at the very start which is well we use Photoshop can I do this can I do that can I do this right but if you've used both you know for a fact right is incredibly hard to use >> like it does take a lot of effort to get to a like and a lot of training a lot of learning to get to a point where you can actually get someone good out of it >> canva >> like I can guarantee my grandma who can only figure out how to use solit Right. She could probably figure out Canva. >> Yeah. >> And I think that's that's kind of the difference. Do they have as many features? No. Do they have is their price point better?

Okay. The price point's better, but it's that experience of when you're just getting in, you can get started and you can feel like a, you know, an absolute hero in terms of, you know, being a graphic designer with having very little skills whatsoever. I've got a friend of mine, I put him onto it >> and this guy's got like the creative power of a rock, man. like he's he's far from creative, but what he's actually been able to output now in terms of branding stuff. I just it's it looks decent. It's not, you know, doesn't look like he's just brought on, you know, 100 grand, you know, design and branding agency or anything, but it's good enough. >> Yeah.

And it's cost effective as well. >> Absolutely. Um, like we always talk about tools of the trade and especially for social media, you do have to have some type of branding and you don't have to go as far as saying, you know, you like I say, you have to go on Adobe Photoshop and learn all this and learn all that. You there are easier apps out there. There are easier things you can use and it's just more about creating the easiest path for yourself where it's not just about the quality of the content, it's how much content you have. M >> and you know if you're going for speed especially like when you're dealing in a time where you got competitors and stuff like that it makes more sense to have an easier platform to use where you can pump this out and get it done because >> you know if you have that really one great photo that you spent six to seven hours doing >> and then you know you got Billy Joe went on Canva >> and pumped out 10 of those >> and they're all roughly in the same basic quality. what what you going to get more out of, you know, you're going for volume and yeah, >> I mean with um so how big is your team now?

Because >> when every time I come to the office and see you guys, I'd like >> barely lift the head from the screen cuz they're all working so hard. >> But your team's grown substantially, aren't they? >> Well, yes, we went So, that was actually that's an interesting point. Um, and again, if you if you sort of if you're following me on LinkedIn, and I'm trying to do YouTube as well, but I've got most of my audience is on LinkedIn anyway, so it's easy just to post there. But, um, I do I do post about being honest about how things are. So, we did hire, um, and we hired in way too early. So, we were trying to grow and grow and we thought, well, let's get more people on and we get more stuff done. >> But the the thing is without cash, your business is basically dead, right? you can't do anything when you're sat there going, "Should I buy a microphone for 20 quid?" And you're going, "Well, probably not." But actually, that's probably a really good investment.

Um, you should still be able to do that and you need cash to grow. So, we made the mistake of hiring way too early. And luckily, those that we hired, we said, and we said, "Look, we've got some cash flow problems. There's I don't want to be in a situation where I've got to drop you in a minute. So, this is what's happening.

Please find another job." Um, and it was not a pleasant day at all. Um, that was probably the hardest day I've ever had and I didn't sleep at all that night beforehand because I like the guys. They're solid and still now I'd go to go to the pub with them every single day of the week. Um, so yeah, if you're out there and you're looking to hire, seriously, think about it. It's it's it's such a huge commitment.

I think it's more of a commitment to hire someone than it is to propose to your misses. Like, >> yeah, >> there's it's it's >> you got someone else's life and you have it. Yeah. Yeah. if they if if you've made that decision rashly, which we did to be fair. Um, and there was a lot of bad circumstances as well.

So, we did have cash coming in. Um, we lost a huge client as well um to turn uh the new year as well. Um, so there was a lot of problems all sort of landing in at once, but it was still quite quite a risky move to make and but we thought look risk it for a biscuit, right? That's that's kind of where we were at. And uh yeah, so look, I think everyone makes everyone makes mistakes at the start.

That's fine. It's how you recognize them and rectify them. If you start burying problems, they're just going to bite you in the ass 10 times worse. You just if you soon as you feel it's a problem, just get on it and solve it. >> So that's an interesting point. So as a business owner and especially as someone who's developed a company, really good advice for people out there.

If you could go back right to the start knowing what you know now, >> what are some things that you'd have done differently in terms of scaling? Yeah. So, there's a there's a couple of things that we did that I wouldn't have done again, and I sometimes flip-flop on these. Um, so the first one was we brought on a sales uh lead generation company >> really early on and they were they were pretty expensive, but >> in my mind and and they had a really good sales pitch to be fair, right? They were spend this much and you'll make this much after.

And I thought I was like I talk to sweat on [\h__\h] right? Yeah. See, that's what happens to me all the time now when you when you get these ads pop up or they get a recharge. Work with me completely free. I'll only take a commission basis.

Yeah. I'm like, "Oh, okay. That sounds great." And then you get screwed over like two or three times. You're like, "I don't trust you." >> Yeah. >> That's it. So, I mean, these guys were um, you know, professional company.

They had great reviews and I think if we were more of a mature company, we we probably would have had more success from them. But because we were a startup and then because of their approach was very much geared towards wellestablished businesses like if you were doing um uh I don't know like I don't you're a plumber and you've you've you've already got a full you know outfit, you got three or four staff, you're kind of ready to scale, loads of good customers, loads of good reviews, you've got your whole business plan and and process down. Um yeah, they would have helped you do that without a doubt. Mh. >> But because I was going into that as a more of a I need to be able to speak to customers. I need to be able to get to know them, understand what their business is, um, really get stuck in um, in order for me to make my product better, right?

And my offering better and how we on board customers better, right? You you went through the onboarding. It's Yeah, you sound like signed up yet. All right. Sweet.

Yeah. So that all of that we're trying to get better, you know, improve on now and and just make a better experience. Um, so yeah, going into and again my my experience has always been more of a corporate environment where it's >> um, you know, there's tons of money to play with, >> but I want to blow 15 grand on some, >> worst case scenario, I'm going to go, seriously, I'm just spend 15 grand on that. And I go, yeah, sorry, mate. >> Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. >> Difference is now it's, oh, that that that's that's a lot of money I'd have blown on on something that I've not really got anything out of. We did get we did get a few customers out of it. Um, but we we would we're probably not going to make our money back for like >> I don't know if they stay on for 4 years, we might make our money back. Um, so >> yeah, >> it's it's one of them. So that was the first mistake that we made.

The second mistake that I think we made was we went too big too soon. >> So we tried to do an awful lot that actually we didn't need to go that hard that quickly. we could have probably done done with a little bit less of the functionality, but I mean you tell me correct me if I'm wrong, but I think if we if we scaled it back a little bit but perfected what we had, >> we probably would have a gone live sooner and started getting customers sooner or b we would have had a better product when we go live and probably had a better experience for everyone that did come on board. So I think that was one of them. But again, I did still fall into that trap. And while I do say, look, you know, go out there and get, I still fell into that trap of it needs to be kind of perfect or we need to have this, we got to have that. And I think the reality is actually I could have, you know, gone live and said, look, this is what we've got now.

This is what's coming soon. And you probably would have been like, well, as long as it's got that bit, I'm all right. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Um, so uh yeah, that that was the other one. Again, hiring too soon. That was another one.

Um I've heard this advice a thousand times. Um, and yet I still made the same mistake, which is, >> uh, signing up for, uh, an office space was probably another too soon as well. But again, we had this sort of a really big client in, we were making loads of money, so it was it was all right. Um, but still, and it is good when we go into the office because it does make a big difference. Um, being able to actually just sit down and work.

I mean, you came in and we sort of did a bit of a this is how things are going. Let's get some feedback. Let's do some user testing. So, we have had arguably more out of that expense than um a sales lead sort of generation guide. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Um but yeah, so there's there's loads of mistakes that you'll make as you go along.

Um I kind of think there's there's tons. Um but yeah, I think they're the three big ones. Keep your costs super low to summarize. Um that's key. I think your ongoing costs or your liabilities if you're starting a business, that needs to be as low as you can possibly make it.

Yeah, like you know it's it's you don't need anything flash to start with. In fact, people will be and again you got to remember where you're at. Your customers should be at this stage pretty friendly. They know where you're at. They know what stage you're at.

So if you're if you're training in a in someone's garage, >> like if you've got a garage at home or your mom's house or like somewhere like that, >> people aren't going to care. >> No. And >> they don't that's not what they want. I think it's a really good point as well because I think the quality of service at the start will never reflect, you know, it's not as if you're trying to go for a big brand. >> You're trying to tell people that this is what I want to do. This is who I want to work with. If you fit this category, I can help you. >> Yeah.

And you know, I think with every business, especially, especially starting out, your first group of customers anyway, they get tre the best. They should do because they're going to be your jumping off point. They're going to be the people that are telling other people that are writing reviews, testimonials, that they're creating the >> they're creating the platform for you to jump off. And >> and no matter what business you're in, but obviously I'll relate it back to PT. when you're getting onto the gym floor or getting online or whatever you're doing, you need to really put as much effort into giving that client the best service you possibly can because they're going to be your jumping off point. And this is what I say when you start doing all this.

You're not really going to make much money to start with. And but it's not about that. It's about creating the business. And the business usually has to move forward before the cash flow and the money catches it up. You've got to establish yourself as a professional.

You've got to let people know what you're doing, how you're doing it, where they can find you. And sometimes you can almost overshoot it a little bit. And I think like you said, keeping your cost low because you're like, "Oh, right. I'm going to get my branded t-shirts. I'm going to get >> always branded. >> I'm going to pay for a really expensive website.

I'm going to go on Google ads. I'm going to like I'm going to hire somebody to and it'll work in terms of projection and your your brand will start moving around but people are going to see it and go oh I don't know what that is move past it >> rather than seeing somebody and seeing a testimonial like this is what we say when you're selling a product or selling a service sell what the service can do for the person rather than what it is you know don't put a price tag saying these pts please charge this much but I only charge this so by me instead saying I can give you this I can help you with this and I can get you to where you need to be people are going to find more value in that >> and people aren't stupid as well they know if someone's looking for a PT they know how much PTS are and from my experience it's you talk to your mates right your mates go I got this PT you know it was best decision I ever made >> well it were your misses was it >> well it was but things started looking for a PT because our friends, one of our friends got a PT >> and they were like, you know, coming around going, "Oh yeah, you know, best decision ever made." And he was like, "Oh yeah, maybe we should look at that." And it's how much do you charge they charge? And so like people already have an idea of how much a PT will cost. >> Um and that's that's one thing that you should probably know is how much are PTS in the area. There's nothing wrong with and you're probably going to hate this, but there's nothing wrong with calling up PTs, pretending like you're looking for a PT. If you're going to start out, >> no, >> go, I am looking for a PT.

I'm in wherever town. Uh, how much do you charge? Just get a rough idea. People in your town, how much they're charging. >> Mhm. >> And just go for average. And again, even though you are not offering the same level of service, but what you're kind of promising is uh like what you were saying, it's it's that that sort of first customer experience thing.

If you go too low and you're sort of shopping around for PTS and you meet one guy and he's like, "Oh, yeah. I work out in my garage, but trust me, bro, we'll be fine. Um, I'm 20 quid a month. Trust me, bro." >> Yeah. It's like immediately I'm I'm turned off, right?

Yeah. Like I I there's no way am I getting like it's just you could be the best PT in the world. Soon as you tell me you're going to be 20 quid a month and I get two sessions a week, I'm going to be like there's there's no way this is going to be any good. It's like like think about your bar. Like if you went into a new bar shop, you shopping around and your barber goes, "Oh yeah, I'll cut your hair for two quid." >> Yeah. >> There's no way you letting him put your clippers near your head.

No way. So just before we finish then, I want to run some quickfire questions cuz I think people want to know what business is like and how to run a business and some tips. So So we're starting out in a business. What would be three things that you tell them to do straight away from establishing a business? uh research everything that you could possibly do. Um uh you know, speak to other people in in the industry.

You can be super friendly as well. There's no reason to be competitive. >> Um just go out there, ask questions, learn everything there is to know. You know, what the price points, what are people doing? What's the onboarding experience like? What's the actual experience when you started?

What tools are people using that make their lives easier? People are willing to share. If if if if anyone's looking to start a similar product to mine, um I'm not going to be upset about it if you reach out to me and say, "Hey, I'm going to compete with you. I think I can do a better job, but I'd love to know sort of where you going to start." Because the reality is is there's that many people in the world. There's enough to go around.

Um and you'll probably make better friends and better connections being that kind of person that's willing to help >> than a kind of person that's going to go, "No, you're on your own. You're not, you know, I'm not not giving you any advice." Blah blah blah. People are happy to do it. every I think most people are and if people aren't sodom >> you'll make you'll make some really good friends doing it that way. That's number one. >> So what's number two? >> Number two um again would just be make sure you've just got some money like proper like a Warchester side. It doesn't need to be underground or something stupid but you just need a bit of cash because >> a lot of people get into um being self-employed thinking I'm going to make a lot of money. >> Mhm. >> The reality is you're not.

Um that's that's a fact. Um, I I I've had it so many times. I've seen it so many times. Um, the reality is the first couple of years you're going to be so broke. You will constantly think, I could be working at Tesco and I'll have more money than this.

That is a reality. You don't do it because you want the money. You do it because you want the lifestyle. And the lifestyle is great. That is a trade-off, right?

Um, you know, I'm here in the morning. I'm doing a podcast. You know, later on I'm going to go to shops and grab some stuff, but you know, hell, I'm going to work tonight, right? And and I love what it is that I do. I was so depressed when I was sat in an office working making someone else wealthy.

That's what pissed me off and that's what made me started, right? Um I was under no illusion that I was going to going to get to a level where I'm rich. But like I think it's it's a a way to kind of think, right, well, I'm in control. If I don't do any work this week, I'm not going to make any money this week. And if you're okay with that, then great, right?

Um so yeah, you're going to need money. That is that is an absolute fact. Um, and there's if you are good at what you do or you know, people will be willing to sort of chuck you a bit of cash and say, "All right, you know, I'll lend you whatever." That that's a reality. Um, so yeah, and the way that I think about it as well when I started is I threw £9,000 into my business, which is a lot, but it's the business that I started was an expensive business to start. Um, I I I I looked at that as to say that is ultimately going to be the same as a university degree. if I was going to go to university and get a degree, that's how I'm probably going to spend that in student loans anyway.

So, s right best I'm going to get the best education in the world. So, and and that's that. Um, third piece of advice I think again just be transparent. Be honest. You know, when you when you're talking to people, don't don't pretend like you're bigger than you are.

Don't pretend like you're you know, you're someone that you're not. And that needs to flow all the way through your business. So, your branding needs to be like I'm sure we've all you know you if you go on to um any like your bank bank system, right? And you look at the website and look at that branding and it's oh we're super friendly and we're here to help you out and then you jump on the call and you just get who are you and what do you want and basically piss off, right? That doesn't line up and that's quite abrasive for a consumer.

So, your brand needs to match your personality, and you need to be okay with the fact that some people aren't going to get with that brand or some people aren't going to like what it is that you do or how you do it, that's fine. You want the people that that that you're going to be able to work with. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Um if you've got uh if you've got a client that's going to just, you know, constantly give you problems, let it go now. Like, just let it go because that is not worth your time. one one nightmare customer where you just don't connect. Um, and they'll find a PT that they get along with or or or whatever.

Um, that's that's totally fine. And that's what I mean by there's enough to go around. >> Yeah, that's a really really good point. And I think that that actually is something that people need to know. >> If you want to work with everybody, you're going to quickly realize not everyone wants to work with you. >> Yeah, 100%. So you not that you should create a niche straight away, but start refining the people you want to work with because once you start building that space, more people filter in into your life and into your business just from creating that space. >> Yeah. >> So last question. As a client, you've been a client to me before, you've been a client to other PTS before.

What are three qualities that you'd probably look for in a personal trainer or an online coach today, especially as someone as professional as you? >> Um, again, it's got to be someone that you get along with, I think. Um, and someone that you can like there's the first PT I had. Um, it was a it was a pure gym and he were so hellbent on just there was no personality behind anything, right? It would just right today you're going to do like 30 of them, 50 of them. Um, and then just tell me I'm doing everything wrong.

Um, it was quite judgmental and a bit like I just didn't want to go. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Like it didn't last long at all because I just always left the gym feeling [\h__\h] and it was like that's not how I should feel. >> No. >> Um, what what what I like is being able to come in. I'm actually quite excited, right? It's almost like, all right, I'm going to hang out with Ken this the morning. We're going to do do a workout.

I'm going to get nice and sweaty. It's going to be, you know, I'm going to get a pump on. Feel good about it >> from exercise. >> Just so just so everyone knows >> sometimes. Sometimes we got money however you got to make money. >> Well, this is what I mean. Like we can come in, we have some bands here, we have a laugh. um do I do work out and I'm I you know I have to get get you know get weighed on a monthly basis um because of my medication and and and and it's I got I could see the progress happening right like it was working um and even though I you know it maybe we had some sessions that weren't as hard as others I was still going in I was still doing something >> um and the reality is actually when I got you know got into my work after you know getting shower about going home.

Um I felt a lot better during the day like I had a lot more energy. Um I was already awake. I was you know I was ready to go and and again it was especially in this day and age where a lot of people work from home. It is I that alone I would say is a great benefit to just get out and just have a chat with someone in the morning. What's your day like?

What you looking at? You know what you doing and all this sort of stuff. So um yeah just someone like that is what you want I think for me. Um, and again, obviously just to show the progress, it's there's this there there's going to be different clientele and again that's where it's like watch your niche. There's some clientele that are going to come in and want to know like they just want to be the next whatever Arnold Schwarzenegger, right?

Like that's that's fine. And there's there's pts that will do that. And um not saying that you can't, but like I think for me what was quite good was that you were able to provide what I was looking for, which was just someone that knows what they're doing. Um is able to coach me through that in a very friendly and natural way rather than a sort of it felt like, you know, I didn't I didn't feel feeling [\h__\h] or dumb or anything like that. It was all right.

Okay. I'm not the best in the gym. Um you know, we make jokes about, you know, my moveability. I'm like an action man. Um, but like we're able to have a lot. >> Yeah, you've got the mobility of a 1980s action man figure.

He's got like three joints in his entire body, but all three of those joints move exceptionally well. >> Yeah. When they go, they go. That's it. So, um, so yeah, I think that's the main point I think is is is you want your customers from my perspective, they want you want them to to actually be quite excited to get to the gym, >> looking forward to it. All right.

This Yeah, okay. It's it's a workout, but make that workout actually fun. It's like if we go to the pub, it's it's you know, I'm not going, "Oh, I got to drink my five pints. That's ridiculous." >> Um I'm going, "All right, yeah, Sam, I'm going to the pub." And it's the same thing in the morning. All right, Sam, I'm going in the morning.

I'm going to work out and it's going to be a bit laugh. Um so I wish I had more time for it now. That is that's the main thing. Um it gets a bit silly. Um I do need to make more time for it.

I said I was going to come yesterday. I didn't. Nope. Um, but yeah, that's that's I think that's that's that's uh yeah, just be friendly. That's that's my my advice.

Just and if people if you just don't click, you don't click and yeah, >> move on. Don't don't force something that's not going to work. >> Perfect. So, what I'm going to do, uh, we're going to put Sam's business details below. So, link to the website, his LinkedIn, and also his YouTube channel. I'm going to link it there.

You can follow Sam's journey. You can follow Axel and MVEDTE. And it's worth watching because I love seeing businesses and companies and corporations start rising up, especially people that are filled with as genuine people as you. >> So, thank you very much for coming in. >> Thank you. Thank you for having me. >> And uh we'll see you next time. Like and subscribe and we will see you on the next one. >> Awesome.

Thank you.